Trout fishing with weights

[Trout Man]

When i went fishing last on the kensico, i got at least 5 good hits on live bait but when i let the fish run with the bait by opening the bail, it seemed to always drop the bait. I was wondering if this could be because when the tension is off the line, the weight falls to the bottom, pulling the bait out of the trout's mouth. If it doesn't directly pull the bait out of the fish's mouth, it may make the fish want to drop the bait because there is something else pulling on the bait. This is just a hypothesis and i was wondering if this could be possibly why the trout kept hitting and dropping the bait. Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks.

[bluefish]

I've had that same thought, especially when fishing with the heavier egg sinkers.    Not sure if it is true, but in any event I prefer to baitfish with conventional reels (smaller, freshwater versions) that have a "clicker" release, or I can thumb the free spool.

But again, it could all be splitting hairs, and make not a bit of difference.     But you're not the first one to have that thought.

[Tom]

I think you are on to something. Lakers at this time of year (in hot weather) seem to more timidly going after live bait.  You have no choice but to include some weights on your line to get the bait down 30+ feet (where the Lakers are biting). My friend got 2 nice Lakers Monday with one 1/8 oz split shot. While I was using 4 split shot and loosing one hit after another. The next time out I will use 1 or 2 split shot weights and use the rubber band trick to hold the line and then open the bail. I had a huge hit with the bail closed but the drag was set VERY loose. After the hit the fish must have spit out the bait because of the line pressure.
Tom

[KenH]

When i went fishing last on the kensico, i got at least 5 good hits on live bait but when i let the fish run with the bait by opening the bail, it seemed to always drop the bait. I was wondering if this could be because when the tension is off the line, the weight falls to the bottom, pulling the bait out of the trout's mouth. If it doesn't directly pull the bait out of the fish's mouth, it may make the fish want to drop the bait because there is something else pulling on the bait. This is just a hypothesis and i was wondering if this could be possibly why the trout kept hitting and dropping the bait. Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks.

I think you may be right. Any fixed weight will fall downward if the tension on the line is suddenly released.
The solution would be not to open the bail after a fish hits but to keep it open fromthe start with the line
held by either a strike guard or as rubber band. And, by using a sliding egg sinker above a barrel swivel the
liner will run through the sinker when a fish runs and the weight of the sinker will not be straight down.
This is the most commonly used live bait rig for trout fishing from a boat.
I also agree with bluefish in that when using this setup I also prefer a baitcasting reel set with a loose drag for
the run, rather than a spinning reel.

[canoejon]

If you're getting the bait back after they drop it, it's very easy to tell if it was a trout or another species. the trout's teeth marks will leave razor blade like slashes on your bait. I'm a big an of minimizing resistance. I'll often take the rubber band off and hold the line as lightly as possible as soon as I see the saw belly getting frenzied. They often do that before they get hit, and other times, they're actually getting chewed up then; in other words, sometimes the trout chews and scarfs, and then runs. I think the last big brown I caught did that. More than once, I've had really big trout sometimes not slam it at all, but just nibble it down slowly, and only after setting the hook (of course, still waiting a good minute) did the freight train take off.

[Pointer]

I also think the weight pulling on the bait will sometimes cause the trout to drop it. I use bait runner spinning reels when Im using live bait and heavy sinkers. This seems to help alot with this problem. I really like the new Shimano bait runners for this type of fishing as they are not as large as the older Shimano's an they can be set very light.

Chris

[ChrisM]

I'm glad to see this being discussed, I've had the same issue with fish dropping the bait and wondered about it. I've tried opening the the bail when I see the bait twitching and the weight drops it away from the fish. I use baitfeeders too (Okumas) but I think even that tiny amount of resistance is still enough to spook a brown. I may try setting the hook a little earlier, because they just don't seem to want to run with the bait at this point in the summer. Or maybe try less weight, though it takes a lot to get a strong swimming sawbelly to the deep sometimes. For those of you who use Okuma baitfeeders- how much weight do you use for lakers?

[Pointer]

Chris M, I have 4 Okuma bait runners so I'm familiar with them as well, I just prefer the Shimano's so I use them alot more. I agree with you that even the bait feeder can be to much at times. What I try an do is when I see the rod is getting a hit I'll pick it up an either feed out the line by hand or I'll open the bail an feed the line between my fingers. I'm not sure even this always helps when the trout are real finicky but I like to think it helps. To answer your question regarding how much weight to use I use 1/2oz egg sinker most of the time. If the bait are small or I'm not going down real far I use 1/4oz and if I'm fishing at night with real large bait I sometimes use as much as 3/4oz. I use the same amount of weight with all the bait runner type reels. Hope this helps.

Chris

[Montrose]

I have had the same issues w/ dropped bait in the past.  As Pointer mentioned I use egg sinkers to allow the line to slip thru as freely as possibly w/ a tiny BB shot to peg the egg sinker.  Then. I just open the bail and let the fish run as much as it will and hope for the best.  I use trebles as well to get a better hookset. 

I honestly think even the drag of the line in the water (if you have a good amount of line out) and it causes a belly in the line is enough to spook the fish into dropping, yet you need the weight to reach the fish where they're suspended this time of year.

The next move I make will be to all flouro spools since it sinks, stretches less, and is less visible to fish anyway.  Hoping this will allow for a lighter weight and maybe less dropped baits in the future while allowing to get the bait to suspended fish more readily.

[KenH]

Personally I think that trout running and dropping live bait is a temporary thing that happens when
they get finicky, or are feeding mostly at night and grabbing baits in the daytime out of
instinct and habit. I don't think I've experienced it lasting much more than a week or two,
excluding the tough spawning times. At those times I find trolling, or jigging if for Lakers,
more effective since they seem more partial to movement and action, and the treble(s)
will usually nail them on such hits.     

[KenH]

I also think the weight pulling on the bait will sometimes cause the trout to drop it. I use bait runner spinning reels when Im using live bait and heavy sinkers. This seems to help alot with this problem. I really like the new Shimano bait runners for this type of fishing as they are not as large as the older Shimano's an they can be set very light.

Chris

Chris, I have a Shimano Baitrunner 4000. They don't make/sell any models smaller than
this is the US do they?

[Pointer]

Ken, I have the Shimano Baitrunner 4000's as well. To the best of my knowledge this is the smallest size they offer. I think they are still bigger than I would like them to be but compared to the older Shimano's they are smaller. I prefer the Shimano to the Okuma but I do like that the Okuma's are smaller. If Shimano comes out with a smaller Baitrunner I would definatley order a pair.

Chris

[KenH]

Ken, I have the Shimano Baitrunner 4000's as well. To the best of my knowledge this is the smallest size they offer. I think they are still bigger than I would like them to be but compared to the older Shimano's they are smaller. I prefer the Shimano to the Okuma but I do like that the Okuma's are smaller. If Shimano comes out with a smaller Baitrunner I would definatley order a pair.

Chris

Chris, I have two Okuma Avengers as well as an Epixor and I have to agree with you that the
Shimano Baitrunners seem better built althogh more expensive. One of our members here pointed
out that Shimano sells the Baitrunner in a smaller size than the 4000 in the European market.

 

[Pointer]

Ken do you know if it's possible to get one of the smaller Shimano Baitrunners shipped here from overseas? Any info that anyone could post about these reels would be appreciated.

Thanks

Chris

[KenH]

Chris, if you go to Ebay and do a search for Shimano Baitrunner
you'll pull up sometjing like 180 reels but if you look through them
you will find some foreign market models like the 2500 series.